In this episode of The Church Podcast, Christopher sits down with Charlotte McCorquodale, researcher and leader with Ministry Training Source, a Catholic research organization dedicated to equipping Church leaders with credible data, practical insights, and formation resources, through the NFCYM Podcast Network.

Charlotte shares how her journey in youth ministry stretches back to the early 1980s — and how that lifelong commitment led her to pursue a doctorate in 2000 and found Ministry Training Source, an organization built around helping the Church form and equip lay leaders. Over the past 25 years, MTS has conducted a series of landmark longitudinal studies on the state of pastoral ministry in the United States, culminating in the recently released Illuminating Trends report.

Together, Christopher and Charlotte explore the most urgent findings from the research: the alarming retention crisis among Gen Z ministry leaders, the persistent gender pay gap in parish ministry, the decline of structured formation, and the cultural representation gaps that remain unresolved after decades of conversation. They also dig into what the data reveals about why young leaders are leaving — and what structural changes the Church must make to keep them.

In This Episode
Charlotte traces the origin of the Illuminating Trends study — from her 2000 doctoral graduation at LSU to a multi-decade longitudinal research effort now spanning five major studies on Catholic pastoral leadership.
The retention crisis in plain numbers: 72% of Gen Z ministry leaders say they plan to stay five years or less, with only 17% indicating long-term commitment — a sharp contrast to earlier generations at the same stage.
A significant shift in why leaders are leaving: for decades, the top reason was to pursue another form of ministry; now Gen Z cites work-life balance, pay, and unsustainable structures — mirroring trends among their secular peers.
The gender pay gap in black and white: in parish ministry, male pastoral leaders earn over $12,000 more per year than female pastoral leaders, even when controlling for education and years of experience.
The formation gap: self-study and mentoring have become the top ways ministry leaders are forming themselves — a sign that diocesan and institutional formation structures have not kept pace or remained consistent enough to be trusted.

Cultural representation remains a long-standing, unresolved challenge: too few pastoral leaders report working across multiple cultural communities, and Hispanic pastoral leaders face disproportionate budget constraints.
The “people power” problem: 62% of ministry leaders identified finding young adults to participate as a significant or very significant challenge — and Christopher and Charlotte connect this directly to the culture of constant ministry turnover.
Bright spots in the data: strong pastoral enthusiasm remains, accompaniment is on the rise (49% engaged), and diocesan leaders showed genuine openness to innovation — which Charlotte sees as a real opportunity for structural change.

About Charlotte McCorquodale
Charlotte McCorquodale is a researcher and leader with Ministry Training Source, a Catholic research organization focused on equipping Church leaders with credible data and formation resources. A youth minister at heart since the early 1980s, Charlotte earned her doctorate in 2000 and has spent the past 25 years conducting longitudinal research on the state of pastoral ministry in the United States. Her most recent work, Illuminating Trends, synthesizes findings from two major studies and offers a grounded, data-driven look at the leadership challenges facing the Church today.

Resources Mentioned
Illuminating Trends Report — Ministry Training Source
NFCYM Accompaniment Project
NFCYM Podcast Network
Connect with Charlotte
Website: ministrytrainingsource.com

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